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[11:35:20] metall1c: не кастыль ? http://dumpz.org/105899/
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[11:39:39] wiz: костыль. use nginx
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[11:41:20] metall1c: wiz: чем он принципиально лучше на недоб
[11:41:26] metall1c: на небольшой нагрузке?
[11:41:42] metall1c: на сильно загруженных хостах его и юзаю
[11:41:44] aries.ua is now online
[11:42:00] metall1c: и php-fpm
[11:42:59] wiz: на небольшой загрузке можно вообще юзать голый gunicorn
[11:44:03] metall1c: ну у меня не один же сайт на апаче
[11:44:14] wiz: ага, поэтому nginx
[11:44:23] wiz: апач в принципе ненужен
[11:44:30] metall1c: у меня больше десятка с небольшой нагрузкой, причем некоторые сильно привязаны к апачу
[11:44:43] metall1c: там всякие правила, которые под nginx лень переписывать
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[11:46:37] wiz: ну продолжай жрать кактус тогда...
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[11:48:39] metall1c: в чем кактус заключается-то?
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[12:06:22] wiz: в http://dumpz.org/105899/
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[12:55:31] chernysh: Добрый день
[12:55:49] chernysh: кто может объяснить, в чем заключается кеширование queryset'а в django
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[12:56:34] chernysh: какой это кеш, на какое время и т.п
[12:56:42] wiz: а как ты его кэшируешь?
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[13:00:13] deepwalker: я вчера как раз код курил
[13:00:20] deepwalker: нового модного prefetch_related
[13:00:38] deepwalker: короче у qs есть аттрибут где кешированный результат лежит
[13:00:52] deepwalker: но если сделать с этим qs что угодно - кеш вылетит
[13:01:09] bobry is now away
[13:01:22] deepwalker: preftech как раз всем qs пишет этот кеш
[13:01:36] deepwalker: пришлось все переписать на проход по скпискам, чтобы кешем пользоваться
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[13:19:23] chernysh: Я не кеширую его, но нужно закешированный результат закинуть в инит формы
[13:19:35] chernysh: Спасибо Дипволкер, думаю оно
[13:19:36] nmk: вау
[13:19:39] nmk: а зачем?
[13:20:05] chernysh: форма формирует очень много multiselect'ов. Их и нужно закешировать
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[13:20:43] chernysh: чтобы нагрузка на сервер была меньше
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[13:21:44] chernysh: вот есть такое поле как forms.ModelMultipleChoiceField
[13:21:53] chernysh: оно принимает параметр queryset
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[13:24:33] nmk: че-то помоему prefetch_related это не то, что ты хочешь
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[13:25:31] chernysh: я и не говорю, что оно. я разбираюсь
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[13:26:48] chernysh: вот сниппет нашел http://djangosnippets.org/snippets/738/
[13:27:14] chernysh: мне бы такую штуку, но не понятно, в кеше только list нужно хранить
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[13:30:32] deepwalker: prefetch сырой
[13:30:40] deepwalker: я его вчера патчил, чтобы он взлетел
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[13:31:49] deepwalker: он в одну то сторону кеш пишет, а вот когда в любом из этих объектов, дочерних назовем, дернуть попытаться папу, то папа будет отдельным запросом.
[13:31:54] deepwalker: это я и пропатчил
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[13:45:24] gigimon: deepwalker: патч отправил?
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[13:47:12] chernysh: я не думаю, что мне нужен prefetch. Дело в том, что мне кешировать нужно вот такое http://paste.in.ua/3399/
[13:47:21] chernysh: Именно модель которая в нутри
[13:47:33] chernysh: или я не допонимаю что-то
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[13:56:49] огыешсук: А что означает точка в выражении
from .boot import PROJECT_DIR
?
[13:57:03] огыешсук: текущий пакет?
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[13:57:49] огыешсук: А если "from ...boot import PROJECT_DIR" то на три этажа над текущим пакетом?
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[14:34:21] wiz: chernysh, http://packages.python.org/johnny-cache/queryset_cache.html
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[15:51:06] _lorien: парни, как хранить в монге бинарные данные?
[15:51:32] _lorien: bson.errors.InvalidStringData: strings in documents must be valid UTF-8 вот так ругается, если пытаюсь загзипованное поле сохранитть
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[15:55:41] _lorien: а, нашёл: http://93z.org/notes/pymongo-and-binary-data/
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[16:45:18] deepwalker: чертова джанга - зачем в group by пихать все поля??
[16:45:30] deepwalker: ну явно же 100% хватит тупого id
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[16:47:05] deepwalker: кто нибудь скажите - ну что за хрень? может уже пора panic и юзать aldjemy?
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[16:50:04] _lorien: мне кажется это группа людей, которые страдают от джанги, но продолжают её использовать :D
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[16:51:10] cutwater: :-)
[16:51:14] cutwater: _lorien: есть альтернативы?
[16:51:27] cutwater: я пока свой велосипед не смог написать и спроектировать так чтобы он меня устраивал во все поля
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[16:51:38] огыешсук: /me страдает от gae, а джанга пусть будет
[16:51:49] cutwater: GAE да уж
[16:52:41] _lorien: Альтернативы, да, можно вообще не заниматься разработкой сайтов :) Или попробовать тот же flask.
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[16:53:49] _lorien: А смысл велосипед делать, только если тебе это удовольствие доставляет, если не очень, то скорее всего кончится терпение до тоого, как ты сделашеь 10% от того, что есть в том же flask :)
[16:54:10] _lorien: Я вот щас делаю велосипед наподобие scrapy - но мне это интересно просто
[16:54:19] cutwater: ну вот мне как бы тоже интересно
[16:54:23] cutwater: ибо я вебом не занимаюсь по работе
[16:54:34] cutwater: но спроектировать нормально не выходит уже в который раз
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[16:57:20] gigimon: _lorien: flask и джанга мне кажется малек разные уровни
[16:57:52] cutwater: мне вот Pyramid по части архитектуры нравится
[16:57:57] cutwater: не считая интерфейсов кучи
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[17:00:22] _lorien: gigimon, ну не знаю, меня джанга то устраивает
[17:00:32] _lorien: народ ругается что на high-load лажает она
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[17:00:57] _lorien: а я ничо под high-load не делал )
[17:01:27] gigimon: [t
[17:01:41] gigimon: на heghload лажает все, что сделано для общего пользования
[17:01:46] gigimon: highload*
[17:01:58] gigimon: или есть что-то, что не лажает?
[17:02:08] _lorien: да откуда я знаю, я не делал high-load :)
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[17:05:03] Tony: django и highload это пиздец
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[17:05:27] Tony: самое обидное что она от версии к версии становится медленнее. последняя эпичная ебля была с апгрейдом с 1.2 на 1.3
[17:05:44] _lorien: ага, я видел где-то график, как один и то те код медленне работает от версии к версии )
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[17:06:41] _lorien: я видел в твитере недавно писал головатый что он возрвщается к работе над джангой и подумает как teimplates сделать побыстрее
[17:07:01] Tony: там не только в темплейтах тормоза
[17:07:06] _lorien: ну я хз, может и не надо юзать её для high-load, для всяких бложеков и cms по-моему очень даже ничего
[17:07:24] Tony: контрибы тормозить с 1.3 стали
[17:07:39] Tony: еще они с wsgi чето мутят постоянно, странные баги получаются.
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[17:08:52] _lorien: я щас сижу, что-то особо в голову не приходит, что там этакого в джанге по сравнению с flask, на практике наверное много бы вылезло всяких вещей :)
[17:09:20] _lorien: мне кажется при достаточно крупном проекте похуй что юзать, будет одинаковая скорость
[17:09:31] _lorien: если архитктуру грамотно спроектировать
[17:09:37] _lorien: ну т.е. проект на пару месяцев хотя бы
[17:09:46] _lorien: скорость разработки, я имею в виду
[17:10:03] _lorien: а так на той же джанге такого говна понаделают, что мама не горюй
[17:10:55] Tony: django это php в мире python и это мне не нравится
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[17:11:20] Tony: кроме того, django это моноархитектура, тяжело архитектуру под highload делать
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[17:13:51] nmk: Tony: ну у меня с 1.2.3 на 1.2.7 была ржака. они там решили в кеше добавить version.
[17:14:42] Tony: в кеше чего?
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[17:17:22] nmk: django.core.cache
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[17:32:40] _lorien: недавно на фласке делал микросайт, так там даже в коробке пагинации нет, но это не проблема, если постоянно делать на фласке что-то, то потом наберётся необходимый набор заплаток
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[17:37:31] nmk: да я тут тоже на фласке кое что писал. пагинацию где-то видел. может с алхимией шла
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[17:58:17] Tony: все же django заебись типа "сайт газеты" или блог
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[17:58:31] Tony: а для заведомо хайлоада я бы выбрал торнадо
[17:58:41] Tony: хотя пол года назад я считал что хуже торнадо нет ничего
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[18:01:49] _lorien: А в чём фишка торнадо?
[18:02:11] _lorien: в джанге тоже я думаю можно асинхронность прикрутить: заюзать pure-python драйвер для базы-данных и юзать это всё поверх gevent
[18:02:43] _lorien: ну понятно то это медленней будет работать, просто потому что это всё говно внутри джанги надо прокручиват :D
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[18:03:01] Tony: ну это будет костылем
[18:03:09] Tony: а с tornado будет более-менее пристойно
[18:03:17] Tony: к тому же, он реально быстрый. я бы раньше выбрал twisted
[18:03:22] Tony: но twisted медленнее чем tornado
[18:03:26] Tony: хотя, они для разных целей
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[18:03:43] _lorien: хм, я ни разу не работал в чисто-асинхронном виде с бд, когда на каждый запрос надо определять callback-функцию, это разве не пиздец?
[18:04:02] _lorien: я вот так понимаю, что и работает торнадо
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[18:04:59] Tony: немного неправильно понимаешь. :)
[18:05:21] Tony: сейчас очень много всяких разных видов асинхронности и работы с ними в python
[18:05:42] Tony: начиная от Deferred из twisted и заканчивая всякими inline callbacks и deferred generator
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[18:09:38] _lorien: а есть пример кода, где пара запросов к бд идёт?
[18:09:44] _lorien: ну там вьюшка какая-нить
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[18:10:02] Tony: полно по интернетам
[18:10:41] _lorien: Deffered это типа такого?
result = Deffered(SQ) - тут асинхронное преключение на другие потоки до тех пор пока не будет готов от бд, потом по мере возможности - опа и мы снова тут и продолжаем работу с result?
[18:10:47] _lorien: * SQL
[18:11:01] Tony: щас я даже пост в блог когда-то писал
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[18:11:12] Tony: http://tony.su/2010/04/18/deferred-and-threads/
[18:11:50] Tony: это пример с twisted. tornado нативно так не умеет, но она умеет поинтереснее. у маньяка про adisp был пост http://softwaremaniacs.org/blog/2009/12/11/adisp/
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[18:13:40] Tony: http://tony.su/2011/09/04/twisted-and-sqlalchemy/ здесь про twisted и SA
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[18:15:37] _lorien: прочитал твой пост в блоге, вообщше ничо не понял :D
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[18:16:00] _lorien: но я не прошу объяснять
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[18:16:10] _lorien: просто не хватает базовых знаний по twisted-терминологии
[18:18:01] Tony: http://tony.su/2010/10/03/twisted-async-for-beginners/ вот это тогда почитай. :)
[18:18:26] _lorien: ага, спасибо, ща покурю
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[18:40:35] deepwalker: _lorien, я когда делал проект с нуля, я не пользовался джангой. Но когда мне попался проект в режиме дедлайн прошел месяц назад, я тут уж как то переписывать с нуля не взялся
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[18:40:51] deepwalker: пожтмоу жру кактус
[18:41:01] deepwalker: ну и плачу, да
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[18:41:28] _lorien: печально что так ещё больше глюков, когда дедлайн позавчера, тебя это заебёт и потом туда придёт другой чел и тоже плакать будет :)
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[18:50:48] deepwalker: а почему глюков больше? :)
[18:50:51] deepwalker: их меньше
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[18:51:23] deepwalker: я плачу и правлю
[18:52:10] deepwalker: ну и я уже подумал, что пора использовать aldjemy
[18:52:15] deepwalker: и не плакать
[18:53:50] _lorien: ну не знаю, если проект уже кривой и надо новые фичи добавлять, то надо сильно стараться, чтобы не преумножать глюки
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[21:28:56] #adler: Добрый вечер
[21:29:44] xa4a: привет
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[21:30:33] #adler: У меня вопрос
[21:31:04] #adler: Можно ли вывести число в консоль и потом обновлять его каждую секунду например?
[21:31:12] xa4a: да
[21:31:19] xa4a: хотя зависит от консоли
[21:31:21] #adler: А не подскажите, каким образом?
[21:31:32] xa4a: с помощью символов backspace
[21:31:52] #adler: лолчто
[21:32:23] #adler: А , все. Нагуглил примерный вариант Спасибо, все.
[21:32:35] xa4a: Oo
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[22:11:01] Tony: может watch достаточно?
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