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[09:32:39] webninja: нашел практическое применение ) щаз заюзаю фласк! ура!
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[12:41:36] metall1c: всем привет, а время выполнения у дажнги как-то где-то ограничивается?
[12:42:02] mishok13 is now away
[12:42:03] metall1c: у меня просто есть страничка с обработкой данных, которая может затянуться на 5, а то и 10 минут, чтобы по таймауту не отваливалось, что делать надо?
[12:42:15] metall1c: или это веб-сервер надо настраивать?
[12:42:17] gigimon: веб-сервер настроить
[12:42:19] gigimon: чтобы он ждал
[12:42:20] erraen is now online
[12:42:24] gigimon: а еще лучше, юзать celery
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[12:47:20] metall1c: что это?
[12:47:22] erraen is now online
[12:47:45] metall1c: а, нагуглил на хабре, щас посмотрим
[12:48:01] aries.ua is now online
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[12:54:13] aries.ua: или в потоки разнести
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[12:56:32] gigimon: aries.ua: не советуй глупости
[12:56:38] gigimon: потоки в джанге глупо юзать
[12:56:57] gigimon: для длительных задач всякие celery и т.п. лучшее решение
[12:57:14] gigimon: не зависишь от веб-сервера, не занимаешь воркера джанги
[12:57:26] erraen is now online
[12:57:27] gigimon: не заставляешь юзера пялиться на загрузку
[12:58:05] aries.ua is now online
[12:58:26] aries.ua: не знаю не знаю, было пару задач. Спокойно разносил на потоки. И проблем не было.
[12:59:53] alexey-grom: кстати как обычно делается управление состоянием какого-нибудь одного глобального воркера через "админку" на чем нибудь?
[13:00:17] alexey-grom: что есть более чем мультипроцессинг, но менее чем celery? )
[13:00:18] sakal is now online
[13:02:04] gigimon: aries.ua: повезло :)
[13:02:25] webninja: целери для фласка норм работает? щаз проектик надо сделать с небольшой вебчастью
[13:02:28] erraen is now online
[13:02:41] gigimon: aries.ua: если не хочется юзать celery, то надо написать хотя бы manage.py команду, которая будет запускаться отдельно и принимать задачи и уже она потом юзать треды и что угодно
[13:03:00] gigimon: webninja: celery плевать где работать
[13:03:05] gigimon: оно не заточено под джангу
[13:03:07] aries.ua is now online
[13:03:20] webninja: !g flask celery
[13:03:20] aries.ua: Ну мне нужен был паралельный поток для вычисления, как раз, что бы клиент не пялился на загрузку.
[13:03:26] webninja: обана
[13:03:30] aries.ua: И потоки нормально справились
[13:03:35] nott is now away
[13:03:48] aries.ua: Если бы нужен был крон, я бы крон и сделал :)
[13:04:19] gigimon: пф
[13:04:26] nott is now online
[13:04:42] gigimon: aries.ua: ты потоки юзал под какие задачи? чтобы юзеру чета отдать или чтобы обработать много данных отпустив юзера?
[13:05:18] xa4a is now online
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[13:05:20] aries.ua: Задача была такая... (пишу)
[13:07:30] erraen is now online
[13:07:34] aries.ua: Когда пользователь заказывал определенный товар. То при заказе формировался пакет данных (архив с данными для заказа, и картинками для дизайнеров). Архив мог быть свыше 100 метров. При однопоточной обработке заказ формировался около 2-3 минут. Так вот всю эту обработку я закинул в паралельный поток, а клиенту сразу отдал контент.
[13:08:02] aries.ua: Если бы потребовался миллион потоков - не вопрос, celery или крон
[13:08:09] aries.ua is now online
[13:08:19] aries.ua: А так, все прекрасно работает :)
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[13:10:33] gigimon: эм, что значит клиенту сразу отдал контент?
[13:11:02] gigimon: и собственно, что делали потоки? ходили в разные источники за инфой или?
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[13:15:15] aries.ua: Контент, это типа "Поздравляю, ваш заказ №1111 принят!" :)
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[13:16:14] aries.ua: Странно, вроде доступно написал, что чего делался потомк
[13:16:18] aries.ua: поток*
[13:17:03] gigimon: аок
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[13:18:58] aries.ua: Потому все зависит от задач и целей, мож у него что-то мелкое, что можно просто распараллелить :)
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[13:31:34] gigimon: aries.ua: я всеравно против потоков в джанге :)
[13:31:40] gigimon: даже в твоем решении
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[13:33:23] sakal: создавать потоки под веб-сервером - это самонадеянно
[13:33:31] aries.ua: Каждому свое, но вариант рабочий и можно использовать :)
[13:33:41] gigimon: у варианта много проблем с надежностью
[13:33:44] sakal: нуну, используй )
[13:33:59] sakal: то что оно пока не падало - это везение
[13:34:07] sakal: посмотришь, когда к тебе прийдёт толпа клиентов
[13:34:26] Сволота is now online
[13:34:55] aries.ua: ну уже полгода ни одной жалобы :)
[13:35:01] aries.ua: Делаю вывод что все ок :)
[13:35:22] xa4a: странно
[13:35:30] sakal is now online
[13:35:37] xa4a: а у тебя есть форма обратной связи для жаллоб?
[13:36:01] xa4a: или мониторинг хотя бы, сколько тредов не доработали до конца?
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[13:36:40] aries.ua: Слушайте, почему вы решили что должны быть проблемы???
[13:36:43] sakal: чтоб делать такой вывод, хорошо бы понимать, что происходит при создании потока в рамках веб-сервера, который не умирает, после завершения основного потока
[13:36:47] aries.ua: Ну нету их, нету!
[13:37:11] xa4a: aries.ua: потому что веб-сервер может твои потоки убивать в неподходяший момент
[13:37:39] sakal: aries.ua: нет слова "нету", есть слово "нет"
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[13:37:48] aries.ua: :D
[13:38:07] aries.ua: Я специально так написал :D
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[14:17:21] Martin: добрый день
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[14:19:53] Martin: не вкурю как в Django юзать статические файлы. хочу в папке /static/ держать всякие css и js, а в шаблоне указать <link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="{{ STATIC_URL }}styles.css">
ман читал, что-то не работает. конфиг: http://pastebin.com/2ea3nUSa
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[14:21:51] xa4a: Martin: что не работает?
[14:21:55] aries.ua: а может надо
<link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="{{ STATIC_URL }}css/styles.css">
[14:22:02] xa4a: что ты сделал кроме конфига, чтобы оно работало?
[14:22:29] Martin: ничего. читал basic use.
[14:22:54] Martin: aries.ua: нет. у меня в сорце хтмл путь вообще не подставляется.
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[14:23:09] Martin: то есть эта переменная просто вырезается
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[14:27:01] aries.ua: TEMPLATE_CONTEXT_PROCESSORS = (
'django.core.context_processors.request',
'django.contrib.auth.context_processors.auth',
'django.core.context_processors.debug',
'django.core.context_processors.i18n',
'django.core.context_processors.media',
'django.core.context_processors.static',
)
[14:27:12] aries.ua: Не вижу у тебя этого в конфига
[14:27:31] Martin: уже добавил media и static. но пока тоже без результата.
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[14:29:59] xa4a: Martin: для начала выкинь темплейты
[14:30:08] xa4a: и добейся, чтобы в броузере просто отдавалось
[14:30:18] xa4a: на /static/css/styles.css
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[14:31:58] Martin: STATIC_URL - это служебное и туда нельзя лезть?
[14:32:16] aries.ua: это константа
[14:32:21] aries.ua: константы не трогают
[14:32:24] Joes is now Yep, I'm here.
[14:32:30] Martin: то есть подмешивать смешивать то, что туда помещено collectstatic и закинуто ручками?
[14:33:02] erraen is now online
[14:33:21] Martin: оно ругается, мол The STATICFILES_DIRS setting should not contain the STATIC_ROOT setting (нельзя смешивать эти папки... хотя имхо при осторожности можно :-[)
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[14:36:24] Martin: так. добился, чтобы встроенный веб сервер корректно отдавал (забыл запятую, вышел не кортеж. пришлось назвать папку со своей статикой как static_files. конечно хотелось бы иметь одну папку под всякую статику. а в media лить всякий контент.)
[14:36:40] xa4a: ты делаешь не так
[14:36:42] Martin: шаблон все выдает как <link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="styles.css">
[14:36:52] xa4a: джанга хочет раздавать статику из одного каталога
[14:36:59] xa4a: а у тебя статика может лежать в нескольких разных
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[14:37:15] xa4a: несколько разных - STATICFILES_DIRS
[14:37:23] xa4a: один, который хочет джанга - STATIC_ROOT
[14:37:47] xa4a: ты должен собрать статику из много разных в один командой manage.py compilestatic или что-то такое
[14:38:02] Martin: это я понял, что со стороны юзера все через /static/. но может быть разбросано по разным папкам.
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[14:38:07] Martin: collectstatic там
[14:38:13] xa4a: после этого вся найденная статика сложится в один каталог и будет раздаваться из STATIC_ROOT по адресу STATIC_URL
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[14:38:57] xa4a: ок, когда сложил - остаётся настроить отдачу статики, что у тебя, видимо, уже работает
[14:39:31] xa4a: чтобы в шаблонах получить STATIC_URL - надо использовать контекст_процессор
[14:39:32] Martin: встроенный веб сервер отдает статику. но вот в шаблоне STATIC_URL не работает.
[14:39:53] xa4a: вот, это уже чёткая постановка проблемы :)
[14:40:04] xa4a: aries.ua выше писал про TEMPLATE_CONTEXT_PROCESSORS
[14:40:06] xa4a:     'django.core.context_processors.static',
[14:40:17] Martin: TEMPLATE_CONTEXT_PROCESSORS = (
'django.core.context_processors.media',
'django.core.context_processors.static',
)
[14:40:20] Martin: прописал такое уже
[14:40:33] xa4a: и при рендеринге шаблона использовать не просто контекст, а реквестконтекст
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[14:41:11] Martin: это связано с view?
[14:41:16] xa4a: да
[14:41:29] Martin: я там юзаю render_to_response из шорткатов
[14:41:42] xa4a: https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/ref/templates/api/#subclassing-context-requestcontext
[14:42:00] xa4a: Note: If you're using Django's render_to_response() <https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/topics/http/shortcuts/#django.shortcuts.render_to_response> shortcut to populate a template with the contents of a dictionary, your template will be passed a Context instance by default (not a RequestContext).
[14:42:35] xa4a: лучше используй render_to из django-annoying
[14:43:06] erraen is now online
[14:43:06] xa4a: (его ещё в саму джангу не встроили?)
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[14:44:06] Martin: пока пишу на чистой джанге... с приложениями, модулями почти не работаю. мне многое не подходит и хочется хакать их сорцы да кинуть в папку с проектом (их обычно кидают в базу либ к интерпретатору). но это вроде не гуд.
[14:44:39] aries.ua: Юзай лучше Flask+SQLAlchemy :)
[14:44:55] Martin: не
[14:45:05] Martin: тест...
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[14:48:41] Martin: фух. долбаный инет. если фласк, то я точно все с пыха портирую. это будет не тру. джанга понравилась, что она клевая, есть админка (правда с русским языком она не особо дружит), есть готовые решения (хоть их придется доводить до моего вкуса).

мне только на пхп нравятся микрофреймворки, а от крупных тошнит (монтры это, много писасины). джанга хоть и монстр по умениям, но в то же время все просто и читаемо. только надо подружиться)
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[14:49:15] Martin: ну и полюбил орм у джанги. это реально удобно.
[14:49:48] Martin: до этого не признавал
[14:49:49] sakal: Martin: ты рискуешь получить джанго головного мозга
[14:49:59] Martin: sakal: это плохо?
[14:50:01] alexey-grom: у фласка тоже админка и алхимия
[14:50:01] sakal: да
[14:50:26] sakal: когда решается вопрос в рамках "джанги" а не используется python
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[14:53:06] Martin: ну я думаю, что не спроста у питона есть такой особняк в виде джанги. хотя можно и на фласк глянуть. но вообще мне кажется, что на нем много придется с нуля реализовывать. я вообще написал одно приложение на Tornado (но это когда я не разобрался с wsgi и джангу считал непонятным монстром). но все же она мне запала :). хоть и есть минусы.
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[14:53:55] gigimon: особняка в виде джанги у питона нету
[14:53:57] gigimon: не морочьте голову
[14:54:24] sakal: я же говорю, джанго головного мозга
[14:54:31] sakal: симптомы уже проявляются
[14:54:47] gigimon: много придется с нуля реализовывать // смешно слышать, после фразы: "только на пхп нравятся микрофреймворки"
[14:54:49] Martin: не, ну если взять пхп, то там много крупных фреймов. если взять руби, питон, то у них по одному по сути крупных фреймворка. рельсы, и джанга соотв.
[14:54:54] Martin: sakal: я и сам замечаю)
[14:55:12] gigimon: Martin: на питоне есть еще пирамида как минимум
[14:55:14] gigimon: тоже крупная
[14:55:26] sakal: и Pylons
[14:55:34] Martin: смотрел GAE Framework. его вроде как два года бросили.
[14:55:40] Сволота: джага когдато была на nodejs портирована, так что питон для джанги не так важен
[14:55:45] sakal: никто GAE не бросал
[14:56:02] sakal: ваще, тут ещё и похапэ головного мозга
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[14:56:20] sakal: Martin: у тебя впереди долгий путь очищения )
[14:56:34] gigimon: Сволота: чего? куда портирована?
[14:56:48] gigimon: это вообще как?
[14:57:07] aries.ua: ломка после PHP долгая :D
[14:57:29] Martin: дык. на пхп некуда деваться, что приходится делать себе простую основу по нраву. та же симфония 2 - это жесть. Yii тоже не особо понятен.
[14:57:35] Сволота: правда из проекта djangode меня интересовал только шаблоый движёк
[14:57:41] aries.ua: правда после питона (flask, django) я на похапе как со спзмом желудка просто смотреть не могу
[14:57:44] Martin: sakal: от джанги? :D
[14:58:02] sakal: от похапэ
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[14:58:27] sakal: и от мысли "смотрел GAE Framework. его вроде как два года бросили."
[14:58:31] aries.ua: flask+sqlalchemy+jinja2
[14:58:40] Martin: jinja там и так из коробки
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[14:59:42] Martin: да вроде не пытаюсь особо тащить пыхопривычки в питон. так бы давно уже портировал имеющийся код на питон. правда жесть была бы. ну а GAE я смотрел, что последняя версия за 2010 год. мб путаю, но не должен.
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[15:00:31] py_two1: xa4a: как в виме прикрутить автоматическое set paste set nopaste ?=)
[15:00:49] py_two1: xa4a: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2555559/vim-pasting-from-clipboard-and-automatically-toggling-set-paste
[15:00:55] py_two1: ну прям никак не работает
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[15:13:47] alexey-grom: почему многие питонщики навязывают что шаблонные решения считаются априори самыми правильными? :D
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[15:14:35] alexey-grom: потоки плохо, фласк - плохо, мультипроцессинг, прямая работа с базой - все плохо. юзай джангу, селери. 500м на ОДИН скрипт мало.. это чо вообще?
[15:15:13] alexey-grom: может потому что тут многие с пхп пришли и работать не любят )
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[15:16:52] Martin: потоки - норм. фласк как микрофрейм понравился. прямая работа с базой... так и работал всегда. разве в джанго орм юзаю.
[15:17:45] Martin: flask-admin ничего так. но боязно выбирать не мейн стрим, когда изучаешь что-то новое. по нему будет меньше информации и наработок.
[15:18:20] erraen is now online
[15:18:40] alexey-grom: в плюсах в борьбе с языком и компилятором люди закаляются и наваять свой фреймворк как нечего делать )) поэтому там кто как хочет так и дрочит. а с питонщиками пиздец: делай так и все! а от велосипедов вообще судороги
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[15:19:09] alexey-grom: но я напоминаю, велосипед это даже если просто не мейнстрим ))
[15:19:17] gigimon: alexey-grom: чего эт ты глупости говоришь? кто тут про фласк и про потоки (там где им место) плохое говорит?
[15:19:32] gigimon: велосипедов в питоне много
[15:19:37] gigimon: наезд странен (:
[15:19:52] aries.ua: Не знаю. первое что я сделал на питоне свои микро прослойки для работы с базой
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[15:21:25] alexey-grom: я об общей тенденции критиковать без разбора ситуации и вникания в задачу. и первым делом тыкать носом в либы которые в 10 раз тяжелее того, что человек пишет
[15:21:32] aries.ua: потом пошли штуки для работы 1С
[15:21:41] aries.ua: потом куча парсеров :) а потом и веб
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[15:26:12] Martin: xa4a: спасибо. добавил context_instance=RequestContext(request) в render_to_response и заработало
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[15:27:09] sakal: alexey-grom: ну мы то знаем, как ты объекты через pipe передаёшь )
[15:27:28] gigimon: Martin: render используй, если джанга 1.3+
[15:28:23] Martin: на 1.3.1 сижу. меньше не планирую. хотя можно и 1.4 поставить).
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[15:28:44] gigimon: тогда юзай render, проще же
[15:29:07] aries.ua is now online
[15:29:17] alexey-grom: sakal: подколол типа )
[15:29:30] alexey-grom: sakal: уже не передаю если чо ))
[15:29:36] sakal: так то
[15:31:16] sakal is now online
[15:33:26] erraen is now online
[15:34:08] aries.ua is now online
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[16:48:56] erraen is now online
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[17:06:53] sakal is now online
[17:08:47] gigimon: Martin: http://blog.fruiapps.com/2012/05/Choose-your-Python-Web-Framework-the-Hard-Way
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[22:17:08] py_two1: xa4a: кстати а новый форум питонсу не собираются в опенсорс кидать ?
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[22:20:43] xa4a: это к slav0nic
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